Audience laughter, NHS and tax promises: Key takeaways from the leaders event

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer were grilled in the second major event of the 2024 General Election campaign, ITV News' Robert Peston and John Ray report

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer were both grilled in the second major leaders event of the 2024 General Election campaign.

Taxes, NHS waiting lists and personal stories from both leaders made up much of the interviews conducted by Sky News' Beth Rigby and from members of the public in Grimsby.

Starmer and Sunak were each interviewed for 20 minutes, followed by 25 minutes of audience questions.

A snap poll after the programme found that Starmer came out on top among viewers.

In the YouGov poll commissioned by Sky, 64% of respondents thought the Labour leader won the night, while 36% thought Rishi Sunak had been stronger. Sky said 1,864 respondents took part in the poll.

Here, ITV News looks at the key takeaways that emerged from the leaders event.

No tax surprises - and tax cuts?

Sunak and Starmer were both grilled on their tax plans.

Starmer said there will be no surprises on tax in the Labour manifesto - due to be published on Thursday - while Sunak has repeated his promise of “tax cuts for people at every stage for people at every stage of their life”.

The Labour leader was pressed about whether his party would consider hiking fuel duty or capital gains tax to raise more cash for the public purse, after he already ruled out hiking income tax, national insurance, or VAT in the next parliament.

“I am not wanting to raise tax. I think people are taxed too much already. What I want to do, my central mission is to grow the economy,” he said.

Starmer said he does not want to raise taxes, and that there would be no tax increases in the party's manifesto, but he did not rule out the possibility of raises in future if he were elected.

A member of the audience asked why young people would believe that the Conservative Party has their best interests at heart

When put to him that increasing capital gains tax to the same level as income tax would raise £14 billion a year, he said: “That is not in our manifesto. That is not a choice we are making."

Sunak repeated his promise of “tax cuts for people at every stage for people at every stage of their life”.

Facing questions about the tax burden potentially being higher than it is now under a future Conservative government, Sunak said his party politics were "for people in work, for people that are setting up small businesses, that are self employed, for those young people who wanna buy their first home, for pensioners and for families.”

NHS strikes and waiting lists

Both Starmer and Sunak clashed with NHS professionals during the event.

Answering a question about the junior doctors’ strike, the Labour leader said: “Well, we won’t be able to do anything unless we win the election. We’ve obviously only been in opposition so far. I have been frustrated, if I’m honest, that these strikes have gone on as long as they have gone on.

Subscribe free to our Election Briefing newsletter here for exclusive and original campaign coverage from ITV News. Direct to your inbox at 5pm every weekday

“The strikes are very bad for patients. People are very anxious about the strike. I don’t think doctors want to be on strike.”

Sunak meanwhile was questioned on the fact that waiting lists have gone up to 7.54 million from the 7.21 million level when he initially made the pledge to bring them down when he became prime minister.

"We've not made as much progress on cutting waiting lists as I would've liked... But we are now making progress," Sunak said.

“Well, I’ve got to say it hasn’t been an easy 18 months in general but what I’ve done though is just keep going to try and do my best for people and that’s what I’m doing in this campaign.”

Starmer said that Labour would remove the tax break on private schools, rather than introduce a new tax, in order to fund state schools

Laughter, boos and insults

Both leaders faced groans and laughter from members of the audience.

Answering questions about the five pledges he made in January 2023, Sunak said: “The most important priority was the first one, because when I got this job, inflation was at 11% and I think everyone knows the last few years have been difficult, the impact that was having on all your bills."

He faced laughter when he said: “It (inflation) was always meant to come down over time.”

Sunak was also met with groans and boos when, reflecting on the strikes across the NHS, he said: “I think everyone knows the impact the industrial action has had, that’s why we haven’t made as much (progress).”

Starmer meanwhile was briefly left speechless when an audience member accused him of being a “political robot”.

The audience member said he admired “how in touch with the public” the Labour leader appeared when he was director of public prosecutions, but said over the last year he had changed, and now seemed "more like a political robot".

"How are you going to convince others like me to vote for you?” he added.

Audience members also laughed when said that he is the son of a toolmaker - a point that he has made multiple times in the run-up to the election.

Personal touches

When asked about what could make him likeable, Sunak deferred to a story about his love of sweets, while Starmer said he was concerned about the affect becoming prime minister could have on his children.

Answering a question about his previous “Dishy Rishi” nickname and urged to share something personal which might endear voters towards him, the prime minister said: “I actually have an appalling diet because I eat an enormous amount of sugar, and I’m very unhealthy in that regard, which I was talking to someone earlier today about.

“They were completely shocked.”

On his biggest fear if he becomes prime minister, Starmer replied: “The only real fear I suppose I have is for my family.”

He said his son is almost 16 years old and his daughter 13, adding these are “really difficult ages” for children.

"My only fear really is the impact it’s going to have on them... I don’t fear the big decisions, in fact I relish the chance to change our country.”

The next big political debate ahead of the General Election will take place on ITV on Thursday, June 13 at 8.30pm.

The ITV Election Debate 2024 will be broadcast on ITV1, ITVX, STV and STV Player.

Have you heard our new podcast Talking Politics? Every day in the run-up to the election Tom, Robert and Anushka dig into the biggest issues dominating the political agenda…