Sunak was 'completely wrong' to leave D-Day ceremony early, admits Mordaunt in multi-party debate
Rishi Sunak's D-Day diary disaster featured prominently in tonight's TV debate between seven political parties, but they sparred over a range of issues from the the cost of living crisis, the NHS and immigration, ITV News Political Correspondent Harry Horton reports
Leading representatives from seven political parties battled it out in a live TV debate in a bid to convince the public that they deserve to lead the country.
Hot off the heels of Rishi Sunak and Sir Keir Starmer's debut head-to-head ITV showdown earlier this week, representatives from the Tories, Labour, the Lib Dems, Reform UK, the SNP, the Greens and Plaid Cymru debated live on the BBC.
Penny Mordaunt, Angela Rayner, Daisy Cooper, Nigel Farage, Stephen Flynn, Carla Denyer and Rhun ap Iorwerth had a seven-way clash over issues including the economy, the NHS, green energy policies and immigration.
Ms Mordaunt and Ms Rayner had a fiery showdown after the Tory minister repeated unfounded tax claims against Labour, while Mr Farage dubbed this General Election campaign "one of the worst" he's seen, calling "Rishi slippery Sunak" and Sir Keir Starmer "Blair without the flare", dull leaders.
Meanwhile, the Greens' Ms Denyer revealed some of the party's key cost of living and climate policies, the Lib Dems' Ms Cooper declared "everything is broken and nothing works" anymore under the Tories, while Plaid Cymru and the SNP earnt applause for hitting out at other parties' immigration policies.
With less than four weeks until polling day, and after a disastrous day of optics for Mr Sunak after he left D-Day celebrations early on Thursday to attend an ITV interview, the first audience question focused on national security.
Defence
Conservative Cabinet minister Penny Mordaunt admitted that the prime minister's decision to leave the D-Day 80th anniversary events early was “completely wrong”.
Ms Mordaunt, a former Royal Navy reservist, said: “What happened was completely wrong and the prime minister has rightly apologised for that - apologised to veterans, and apologised to all of us that he was representing all of us.
“I’m from Portsmouth, I have also been defence secretary and my wish is, at the end of this week, is that all of our veterans feel completely treasured."
Asked if she would have left D-Day commemorations early by BBC presenter Mishal Husain, Ms Mordaunt sidestepped the question. She replied: “I didn’t go to D-Day. I think what happened was very wrong, I think the prime minister has apologised for that.
“But what I also think is important is we honour their legacy, they fought for our freedom, and unless we are spending the right amount on defence we can’t honour that legacy.”
It was not long before Ms Mordaunt and Labour's deputy leader Angela Rayner clashed over their respective parties' plans for defence.
The Conservative Cabinet minister said it is "too late" for Labour to have any credibility on national security, insisting that Ms Rayner "voted to end our nuclear deterrent".
Ms Rayner said: "My brother served in Iraq, I won't be lectured on whether or not I'm absolutely committed to the security of our country."
"Well its surprising then that you're not better informed," clapped back Ms Mordaunt.
Reform UK's new leader Nigel Farage also took a swipe at Mr Sunak, calling him a "very unpatriotic" prime minister after he "deserted" veterans.
Ms Mordaunt said she didn't want this issue "to become a political football," but Mr Farage insisted "it already is because the veterans themselves are speaking out saying he’s let the country down.”
SNP Westminster leader Stephen Flynn added: “We need to be standing with our veterans. We need to make sure that our military is fully funded and that we have more people serving, and that we look after them when they become veterans.”
He added: “A prime minister who puts his own political career before public service is no prime minister at all.
“A prime minister who puts his own political career before Normandy war veterans is no prime minister at all.
“So it’s incumbent upon all of us to do our national service and vote the Tories out of office.”
NHS and healthcare
The next question focused on the state of the NHS and health and social care at large across the UK.
A medical student sat in the audience asked the candidates how they can ensure that she will graduate into a functioning NHS.
Mr Flynn earned the first applause of the night after vowing medical students in an SNP-controlled Scotland wouldn't have to pay tuition fees. He added the NHS in Scotland has “record funding” and no strikes, unlike other parts of the UK.
He then received a round of applause when he added: “Given that you’re going to university to study medicine I think it’s also important to remind everyone in this audience the difference between the SNP and the Westminster parties."
Mr Flynn also claimed that under a Labour government “£18 billion of cuts are coming down the line” and that “all roads lead back to the Tories over issues within the NHS.
Ms Rayner insisted Labour will end the non-dom tax loophole to fund 40,000 new appointments every week, hitting out at the fact patients are often "on trolleys for hours on end not getting the care they need” under Mr Sunak's government.
"The non-dom is not going to close the £18 billion fiscal gap which the Institute for Fiscal Studies says exists," clapped back Mr Flynn.
“There is a conspiracy of silence between the Labour Party and the Conservative Party in relation to this.”
Mr Farage insisted: "Whether it’s Labour-run Wales or SNP-run Scotland or Conservative-run England, we all know that whilst you can get great care, the NHS isn’t working, you can’t get GP appointments things that we’ve all grown up taking for granted.”
Immigration
An audience member said they were struggling to find a house, complained that the roads are busier and doctors' appointments are ever hard to find - they said they blame immigration.
Mr Farage was quick to jump on the audience member's concern and said "this ought to be the immigration election".
Plaid Cymru's Mr ap Iorwerth hit out at the Reform UK leader, saying: "Nigel Farage wants to make this an immigration election for his own self-interest, lets change the tone.”
The audience erupted into applause as he continued: “Lets change the tone of the debate on immigration, frankly too much of it is framed around the bigotry of people like Nigel Farage."
“Is that the best you can do,” clapped back Mr Farage, to which Mr ap Iorwerth continued to hit out at the Tories and Labour.
“Penny Mordaunt can’t stand up to Nigel Farage because she wants her party wants to be like Nigel Farage," he continued. “Angela Rayner can’t stand up to Nigel Farage because of the shift in her party to the right."
Mr Flynn argued "migration is essential" and called for an "end to the demonisation of migration".
Ms Rayner insisted: “The problems with housing, the roads and the GPs and public services is decimation the Tories have done to our public services.”
Ms Mordaunt interjected: “Your leader (Sir Keir Starmer) campaigned for free movement.”
Ms Rayner continued: “We would scrap the Rwanda scheme. We would put that money into a Border Force Command which would be able to smash the gangs because we need to do that."
Taxes
The focus turned next to the cost of living crisis and taxes, with an audience member asking: "We are working to survive, not live. Who will change things for working people?”
The Lib Dems' deputy leader Daisy Cooper said her party "fought the Conservatives every single day in coalition and we just have to look at the damage the Conservatives have done on their own since 2015".
"Not only has there been Brexit but there has been this awful mini-budget," she added.
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Addressing the audience member, she said: "I speak to hundreds of people in your situation – people who play by the rules, people who work hard, people who pay their taxes, and they’ve almost got nothing to show for it.
"And on top of that, when they go to use their public services, everything feels broken – nothing works.”
Ms Mordaunt quickly alleged, again, that Labour will put up every working household's taxes by £2,000 per person - a claim that has been proven to be unfounded.
Labour has repeatedly reiterated that they have no plans to up tax and that the £2,000 figure is "absolute garbage".
In a statement on Thursday, the Office for Statistics Regulation, which previously warned political parties to use figures appropriately during the campaign, investigated the claim and suggested the Conservatives had failed to make clear their calculations.
It came after a leaked letter from the top Treasury civil servant cast further doubt on the tax claim - but the prime minister and the Tories have continued to double down on the claim.
“We have got to cut people’s taxes and we have got to alleviate burdens on business," said Ms Mordaunt. "Angela Rayner and the Labour Party – Keir Starmer confirmed this earlier this week – they are going to put up your taxes by £2,000 per working household.”
Ms Rayner interrupted: “That is a lie.”
She shakes her head, adding: “Penny, your government have raised taxes to a record level in 70 years.”
Ms Mordaunt continued to raise her voice over Ms Rayner, before the Greens' co-leader Carla Denyer joked: "Well that was terribly dignified wasn't it" earning a round of applause.
"Penny is talking about a cost of living crisis but you might more accurately describe it as an inequality crisis," she said, adding that during the pandemic some people got wealthier while others struggled further.
Ms Denyer also hit out at the "cruel two-child benefit cap" that both Labour and Conservatives have not vowed to scrap, winning another round of applause. She pledged the Greens would remove the cap as well as the "ageist" cap on the £15 minimum wage.
Outlining the Green’s plan for addressing the cost of living crisis, Ms Denyer told the audience at the BBC debate: “It doesn’t happen to be like this, we could have well-paid jobs, secure jobs and a welfare system that really acts as the safety net we need to catch people when they fall."
Green policies
An audience member asked: “What matters to your more, economic growth or successful climate policy?
“It depends what those climate policies are," said Ms Rayner, accusing the Tories of “pursuing completely unrealistic climate policies,” adding: “Not only is it impossible, it’s actually unaffordable”.
“What we’re doing in this country is we’re sacrificing economic growth, we’ve been massacring British manufacturing, and we say to ourselves isn’t it marvellous, we’ve reduced carbon emissions more than any other Western country. But we haven’t. All we’ve done is to export carbon emissions when our steelworks go to India, or our car manufacturers move to China or Turkey or wherever it is. We’re living in a complete false paradise in all of this."
Ms Mordaunt claimed Labour’s GB Energy policy will result in “giant bills”, adding: “Angela mentioned GB Energy, do you know what the GB stands for? It stands for giant bills, and more bills are coming with the net zero plans that Labour have.”
Ms Denyer said the Greens' policies on climate change would also help ease the burden of the cost of living crisis, adding: “A green economy would create jobs, well-paid jobs, distributed all over the country, for example, on a nationwide home insulation programme which would bring down everyone’s bills, help with the cost-of-living in the here and now and give us warm and more comfortable homes, create hundreds of thousands of green jobs and support local businesses.”
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